Moonkins – Cloth vs. Leather
Reader questions pour in all the time, and I apologize. In between the full-time job, reapplying for college (OMG), raiding 12 hours/week, managing two blogs, and all my recent guild drama, its been hard to write good stuff. If you care to see what my guilds been up to recently, most of it is up on the link above which goes to Ulduar25.com. We are currently pushing to kill Yogg this week on 25, which would be great.
I’ve already seen this topic covered before by a couple of different moonkin bloggers, but I received this question a couple of times — people want to know my opinion. I’ll lay it out as simple as I can –
If your guild does not let you roll on cloth as a main spec roll, you probably should not be in that guild.
That is my honest, unbiased opinion. With the exception of tier gear, there is no leather on our BIS list, and no leather that I aim to get. It seems that all leather gear currently available is designed for resto druids, or as small upgrades for boomkins, but nothing that we really want.
I can understand Blizzard’s logic, however, in making leather gear function for either resto druids or balance druids. They have made it clear that they don’t want a piece of loot to be exclusively available to a certain class/spec — think, feral druid staffs, druids using polearms, the merging of spell power and healing gear, etc. For them to make a beautifully itemized (no spirit and 3 sub-DPS stats) piece of leather gear, it would pretty much be identifying the piece as strictly a moonkin piece of gear, and people would get angry if it dropped often.
I also see the other side of the argument – clothies can only roll on cloth, yet boomkins can roll on cloth and leather. It is somewhat of a valid point, but the concept doesn’t hold any water when there is hardly any good leather gear for druids (I am a bit picky in my gear choices 
).
So, if your guild leader, raid leader, or master looter won’t let you roll on cloth, I strongly recommend you look for another guild. If they do not know enough about the different classes in the game to know what type of gear moonkins are looking for, then chances are they are overlooking other key matters, both in the game and in the guild as a whole.
So, in conclusion, here are your choices for your next step:
- Talk to your guild leader, send him links to my blog and others that discuss the cloth vs. leather debate. Also, try to tell him specific items you are seeking that are cloth, and see if he can make exceptions on a per-item basis.
- Settle for what leather you can get, there are some decent pieces out there but most cloth is better. Still, if you get 5/5 tier pieces, than there are really only 3 item slots that you would have to fight him for.
- Join another guild that allows moonkin to roll on cloth.
Sorry for the short post, but I haven’t had many new moonkin topics to discuss, so if any of you have anything you would like to discuss or see blogged on, please email me.
Macbook
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http://tobolds.blogspot.com/2009/03/naxxramas-loot-table.html
This is a good article about loot distribution. Moonkins can only access basically only the caster portion type Leather Gear. To lockout them out of Cloth Caster gear would be limit the growth potential of your druid casters.
Valid point however I’m a GM in a raid guild using dkp…my ruilling is Cloth gets preference and tbh none of my clothies ever roll on the stuff anymore as they dont need it so druids get to roll on the cloth…I’m a druid myself and you dont know how it is to be moaned at as RL / ML when a clothie looses gear to a druid! put yourself in the other armor classes shoes mate tbh. yes cloth stats are better for your spec but how would you like another class rolling on your boomkin gear with you or your feral gear -_-
I play a Disc Priest and a Marks Hunter, among other classes whose gear overlaps with those of other classes. It sucks being *anybody* that gets moaned at by *any* class that loses gear to *any other class* – but they’d be whining if it was another priest, or another mage, or another warlock, not just a druid.
That is the point where you tell the whiners, “That’s nice. Suck it up.” You don’t have to be a raid leader to know what it’s like to deal with loot QQ.
@OP: I had no idea there were no leather BiS items for Boomkin. Thanks for the post and the insight. I’ve always let caster classes roll on cloth in heroics (people don’t argue with me because I am scary), now I understand a bit more why it’s so necessary for Boomkin.
I’d like to make a few points here.
The first will be directed at the comment by Sareena. If you’re using a DKP system and you’re still restricting what people can roll on, you’re doing it wrong. It’s their DKP to spend, let them spend it how they want to. If they “waste” their DKP, that’s up to them. If the moonkin has more DKP than the mage and ‘lock, it’s because they earned it, so why not let them roll on a best in slot item?
Secondly, in Naxx, we *needed* to roll on cloth to be at our best. In Ulduar, this is less of a problem. Of the three non-tier best in slot pieces, the belt and boots can be crafted, leaving only bracers to roll on. If your guild leader/raid leader/master looter won’t let you roll main set on ONE cloth item, out of eight slots, explain to them that bracers are the ONLY slot you need to roll for a cloth item on (I think there is only one set of leather bracers in Ulduar). At that point, they seems unreasonable if they say no; if they say yes, even better. Try talking to some guildies, especially cloth DPS, beforehand to see if you can build some support for the idea.
Third, put it to them (the guild leader/raid leader/master looter) this way: you could just have easily rolled a mage or ‘lock, but you opted for a class that provides more raid utility, in the form of a powerful aura, an in-combat res, and Innervate. They shouldn’t be punishing you for that choice.
Fourth, and this is the best advice I can give, come up with a best in slot list and post it on your guild forums with a link to wowhead for each item. If you agree to only roll on cloth items that are truly best in slot for you, you may be able to convince your guild officials and other clothies to let you roll.
* Make no mistake about it, if you can’t roll on cloth as a moonkin, your DPS will not be where it should be. There are paths of diplomacy that you could try before just leaving (I don’t think Mac was advocating just packing up and leaving anyways), and getting other clothies on your side will go a long way in convincing guild officials. *
I have to agree with you on that point. I was with a guild pre-3.1 that would not allow me to roll on cloth items. In this case it was a headpiece. I let it go for 2 weeks and did not make too much of a stink. But enough was enough when one night they decided to DE the item instead of letting me take it on the roll. I gquit on the spot, not worrying about the raidID.
I did make sure to screenshot what happened in chat and glad I did. The GM tried to make me look bad in the forums to the new guild I was trying to join.
So gear drama is just as bad as any other drama out there
Faggots.
Author : Fatty (IP: 75.100.184.240 , h75-100-184-240.lactwa.dsl.dynamic.tds.net)
^ Disgruntled mage.
Just wanted to emphasize Xiera’s 4th point, best tip out there.
We have a “Top 5 Wishlist” type thread on our guild website. People put their top 5 most wanted items, and if they put it on their list, they usually get it when it drops, regardless if its a hunter wanting leather gear, or something like that (although that doesn’t happen really).
Wow — that’s pretty extreme, glad to hear you got out of that guild bro.
@Xiera, xD
I ended up leaving my old guild over this very issue! Our loot master/raid leader (a holy priest) set loot priority as such:
1) Cloth-wearing spellcasters, main spec
2) Cloth-wearing spellcasters, off spec/second spec
3) All others
4) Shard it
Despite pulling up numerous websites showing him how right now, many of our top slot items are cloth (via MaxDPS), and despite 4/10 of the guild's top raiders being druids (one resto, one boom), I was pretty much told that I was being a terrible person and "not a team player" for even bringing the issue up. He further went on to tell me that if I (and our other moonkin) weren't going to raid with them anymore over this issue that we were easily replaced by an Ele shaman or someone else, "more willing to help the group." (read: let the loot master/priest roll on all of the best gear)
/gquit
Laser owls get no love, seriously.
As a casual raider, I am against this policy. I have proven to myself time and again that I am able to take the *leather* in slots and put out numbers that are high enough to comfortably clear content. Hence, when cloth caster gear drops, and I allow clothies to roll on it, when leather gear for that slot I want *does* drop, now a clothie has an epic in that slot, and I do as well. However, if I roll on the cloth, and win, and then the leather piece drops, the leather epic gets DE'ed.
The exceptions are when my *best* in slot drops, and it happens to be leather, and the next best leather piece is just teh suck. The other one is where me and the clothie both have epics of the same ilvl for the content we're clearing.
It's all about getting the *raid* the gear they need.. during the time where a guild is gearing up, having to disenchant items is the *worst* thing to happen in terms of gear distribution policy.
/Agree with duskstorm, when it comes to rolling over gear. Only BiS items should be rollable by people downgrading armor from their main armor. And even then if its a clear shot that the clothy is in MORE need of it then they should get it regardless.
Glad you quit that screwed up guild.
What kind of a brain dead retard would DE any item that someone wants, for any reason???
I don't care if a DK wants cloth just because it looks pretty, lol.
ANYTHING is better than destroying it!
I feel DE is 1 step above vendor trash.
I would rather see someone get some fun out of it rather than destroy it, but even if you are some kind of anal retard LM, then at the very least trade it to them for a Dream Shard, Abyss Crystal, or 10g, but why destroy it if someone wants it, FOR ANY REASON?????
I swear some people are brain dead.
It's a game, HAVE FUN, Don't be an a-hole!
I hope that guild or at least that LM is long gone.
Obviously the guy just ruined it to be an a-hole. There is no other reason.
I sure wouldn't want to be in a guild where they treated its member like that.
If I even saw someone do that, I would have quit right there too.
I am surprised that others in the raid that saw it didn't /gquit.